Hell
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:10 am
Hello everyone! Hope you're all doing well!
I've been thinking about hell a lot the past few days, and how odd it is as a religious teaching. I find it very difficult to conclude that hell as a concept is anything other than a fear tactic, and it boggles the mind a bit than any religious or spiritual person could buy into such a hateful teaching as this. Because I was raised Catholic I did fear the threat of hell growing up, and my mind turns to it often in trying to puzzle out the layers. I do not 'believe' in hell, but what I want to explore here is the very concept itself, the way that it is used, and why I feel that it could never have been possible that such a place existed.
When people speak about Jesus, I think they tend to forget that he and his followers were all Jews. Everyone who lived in that part of the world at that time was either Jewish or Roman. There really weren't too many other influences. Now, if Jesus was Jewish, and the Christian faith sprung up out of his life . . .where did the idea of hell develop? Jews don't believe in hell. Who invented hell, and when did they invent it?
One of the things I find most painful about hell is that a great many people go on believing in it, and I think about what tremendous suffering this must cause for them. An example often comes to my mind of a little old Italian lady (frankly, I'm picturing my own grandmother, who was 4'5" and spent hours praying the rosary every day ). If you've ever known one of these tiny little ethnic Roman Catholic ladies, you will know exactly what I mean -- they are fervently religious, and are very deeply moved in their prayer sessions. Now imagine one of these little old ladies having a husband and a son who is in the mafia. It's happened thousands and thousands of times, right? They pretend they don't know what their husband is up to -- but they know. Of course they know. And they're Catholic.
Now believing as they do, they must believe that their husband and their son will go to hell when they die. They're there killing people, stealing, and breaking commandment after commandment, day after day. The level of violence in that culture is astonishing, and there is very little in the way of "good works" either.
Supposing this little old lady has led a relatively quiet, 'good' life -- raising her family; caring for everyone; cooking and cleaning and so on, as Italian ladies do. She is relatively free from sin . . .certainly even she must believe she will be allowed into heaven.
But what about her husband? What about her son?
So while she is here on this earth -- she suffers the tortures of hell because she believes they will one day go to hell. This creates hell on earth, and here it isn't even true! All that pain and heartache she must feel, and for what?
Meanwhile, supposing that this little old lady is correct in her thinking - her husband really will be damned to hell when he dies. But the little old lady will make it into heaven. Will it truly be a heaven? If the two people you love most in this world, your husband and your son, are damned to hell, heaven ceases to be heaven, doesn't it? It's not paradise at all -- it has transformed into hell.
If the righteous go to heaven and sinners go to hell, then all the righteous who love sinners are also damned to hell. This is another reason that the teaching of hell is impossible. It is too cruel. It takes us beyond personal responsibility and puts us in a position where we suffer even with the choices of others.
Then there is the layer that a loving God could not allow such a place. When I tortured myself as a young child with fears of hell, I imagined the worst -- just as I was taught to do. And even as a child, I couldn't imagine anyone being guilty of a crime so great as to be sent to such a place for the whole of eternity. So to imagine a God who could send a soul to that place -- ! It is unthinkable. It would be bad enough if it was just for a visit -- even that would be insane. But for all of eternity? It's not possible. If God indeed sends souls to such a place, he's frankly not worth worshiping; he's no better than the devil. He is the devil!
Growing up with the belief that God does indeed send souls to this place, it made it very difficult for me to find God as a loving figure. I was terrified of God, and I was constantly worried that I was upsetting him. He seemed so touchy in all the stories I'd ever heard about him -- and he had allowed his son to go through that hideous torture all for our supposed benefit.
Coming to this board years ago and learning about the Lucifer Rebellion was such a sunny day for me. In the days since, learning more about our Midwayer friends and the wonderful work they do has done a great deal to soothe my mind. I am slowly healing from the painful lessons of my upbringing, and while I no longer fear the threat of hell, nor believe such a place exists, it pains me to witness how many go on believing in this place, and speaking of those who will inevitably be sent there.
Those who speak 'in Jesus' name' and condemn others to hell -- I find this unspeakably cruel. When I see picketers holding up signs proclaiming that God hates gay people and that they will go to hell . . .these are religious people? I see folks with those bracelets that say WWJD -- What would Jesus Do? -- and I just think, do you think he'd do this? Hold up those ugly signs? I never read a story like that about Jesus. Wasn't he the one who urged us to stop judging others?
It's such a blessing to me to find this lovely 11:11 home, and to know that there are like-minded people who view God as a figure of love, not the old fire and brimstone figure many of us were raised to revere/cower in the presence of. I prefer this softer God, this gentle and loving God, and I can't thank our family here on this board enough for giving me a safe place to land after all those years fearing the worst. Thank you to all of you!
If anyone here has stories to share or their own thoughts about hell, I would love to hear your ideas. It's a comfort to me and it would be interesting at the same time.
With love to everyone, Michele
I've been thinking about hell a lot the past few days, and how odd it is as a religious teaching. I find it very difficult to conclude that hell as a concept is anything other than a fear tactic, and it boggles the mind a bit than any religious or spiritual person could buy into such a hateful teaching as this. Because I was raised Catholic I did fear the threat of hell growing up, and my mind turns to it often in trying to puzzle out the layers. I do not 'believe' in hell, but what I want to explore here is the very concept itself, the way that it is used, and why I feel that it could never have been possible that such a place existed.
When people speak about Jesus, I think they tend to forget that he and his followers were all Jews. Everyone who lived in that part of the world at that time was either Jewish or Roman. There really weren't too many other influences. Now, if Jesus was Jewish, and the Christian faith sprung up out of his life . . .where did the idea of hell develop? Jews don't believe in hell. Who invented hell, and when did they invent it?
One of the things I find most painful about hell is that a great many people go on believing in it, and I think about what tremendous suffering this must cause for them. An example often comes to my mind of a little old Italian lady (frankly, I'm picturing my own grandmother, who was 4'5" and spent hours praying the rosary every day ). If you've ever known one of these tiny little ethnic Roman Catholic ladies, you will know exactly what I mean -- they are fervently religious, and are very deeply moved in their prayer sessions. Now imagine one of these little old ladies having a husband and a son who is in the mafia. It's happened thousands and thousands of times, right? They pretend they don't know what their husband is up to -- but they know. Of course they know. And they're Catholic.
Now believing as they do, they must believe that their husband and their son will go to hell when they die. They're there killing people, stealing, and breaking commandment after commandment, day after day. The level of violence in that culture is astonishing, and there is very little in the way of "good works" either.
Supposing this little old lady has led a relatively quiet, 'good' life -- raising her family; caring for everyone; cooking and cleaning and so on, as Italian ladies do. She is relatively free from sin . . .certainly even she must believe she will be allowed into heaven.
But what about her husband? What about her son?
So while she is here on this earth -- she suffers the tortures of hell because she believes they will one day go to hell. This creates hell on earth, and here it isn't even true! All that pain and heartache she must feel, and for what?
Meanwhile, supposing that this little old lady is correct in her thinking - her husband really will be damned to hell when he dies. But the little old lady will make it into heaven. Will it truly be a heaven? If the two people you love most in this world, your husband and your son, are damned to hell, heaven ceases to be heaven, doesn't it? It's not paradise at all -- it has transformed into hell.
If the righteous go to heaven and sinners go to hell, then all the righteous who love sinners are also damned to hell. This is another reason that the teaching of hell is impossible. It is too cruel. It takes us beyond personal responsibility and puts us in a position where we suffer even with the choices of others.
Then there is the layer that a loving God could not allow such a place. When I tortured myself as a young child with fears of hell, I imagined the worst -- just as I was taught to do. And even as a child, I couldn't imagine anyone being guilty of a crime so great as to be sent to such a place for the whole of eternity. So to imagine a God who could send a soul to that place -- ! It is unthinkable. It would be bad enough if it was just for a visit -- even that would be insane. But for all of eternity? It's not possible. If God indeed sends souls to such a place, he's frankly not worth worshiping; he's no better than the devil. He is the devil!
Growing up with the belief that God does indeed send souls to this place, it made it very difficult for me to find God as a loving figure. I was terrified of God, and I was constantly worried that I was upsetting him. He seemed so touchy in all the stories I'd ever heard about him -- and he had allowed his son to go through that hideous torture all for our supposed benefit.
Coming to this board years ago and learning about the Lucifer Rebellion was such a sunny day for me. In the days since, learning more about our Midwayer friends and the wonderful work they do has done a great deal to soothe my mind. I am slowly healing from the painful lessons of my upbringing, and while I no longer fear the threat of hell, nor believe such a place exists, it pains me to witness how many go on believing in this place, and speaking of those who will inevitably be sent there.
Those who speak 'in Jesus' name' and condemn others to hell -- I find this unspeakably cruel. When I see picketers holding up signs proclaiming that God hates gay people and that they will go to hell . . .these are religious people? I see folks with those bracelets that say WWJD -- What would Jesus Do? -- and I just think, do you think he'd do this? Hold up those ugly signs? I never read a story like that about Jesus. Wasn't he the one who urged us to stop judging others?
It's such a blessing to me to find this lovely 11:11 home, and to know that there are like-minded people who view God as a figure of love, not the old fire and brimstone figure many of us were raised to revere/cower in the presence of. I prefer this softer God, this gentle and loving God, and I can't thank our family here on this board enough for giving me a safe place to land after all those years fearing the worst. Thank you to all of you!
If anyone here has stories to share or their own thoughts about hell, I would love to hear your ideas. It's a comfort to me and it would be interesting at the same time.
With love to everyone, Michele