The benefits of reading the Urantia Book

[Sandy]

Hi Rod,
I appreciate these postings concerning the Urantia book. I am rereading it, this time back to front with the Jesus papers first. LOL I forgot why I started there, now. It isn't important but I suspect there are going to be some "ah ha" moments that will be important for some reason or another. It is so easy to read this huge book and not see everything. For instance, something Jon shared with Eric recently I didn't even remember ever reading before.

LOL Now I am remembering some years ago when you and I tried to "speed read" the book.

Anyway, you have my deepest gratitude for all you do to help enlighten us on our spiritual journeys.

xxSandy

[CAM7215]

So, the Urantia Book has been downloaded and unzipped on my laptop. Help! The sheer volume is overwhelming - where do I start? Yes, I know --- at the beginning ... just attempting to process ...

[happyrain]

Hi CAM!

It would be nice to meet you on one of these Zoom calls with Sandy and Job aka Starwalker.

www.urantia.org

We started with the forward, and Jon made the nice recommendation of listening to the audio version. It helped me!

These zoom calls started as an informal meet up, and it's just really nice to chat with the folks who decide to come here. To put a face and energy to the name.



Well, I have to meet you guys in the no-time meditation here soon enough.

Cheers!

[Starwalker]

So, the Urantia Book has been downloaded and unzipped on my laptop. Help! The sheer volume is overwhelming - where do I start? Yes, I know --- at the beginning ... just attempting to process ...

Hi CAM,

The UB can be a lot to take in. Though I have just begun reading A Course in Miracles, I'm finding that it is more focused on the love of God. The Urantia Book shares this theme throughout. However, I think the UB may get deeper into the mechanics of it all, the technology of Spirit one might say.

When I first started looking into the UB used the audio that is available online at urantia.org. If I came to something that I couldn't quite grasp, I just moved on. There was plenty in there that I could understand, so I just took from it what I could. Years later I'm finding that I'm gaining a deeper understanding of these truths. There are also many videos on youtube that help. Here are a few of many beautiful videos by Gary Tonge:

The Urantia Book Introduction: https://youtu.be/_wf21UbsdJ4?si=UtL9sMqZSKoZLbUO

The Urantia Book - What is Revelation: https://youtu.be/UeFUccAV5Nk?si=um1VJw3cmBPXG9lX

The Urantia Book - Encouragement: https://youtu.be/A9IeeX6k_8U?si=CbHqtxnkEpzzqrrE

The Urantia Book - Journey Through the Universe: https://youtu.be/9CkbbohKDoY?si=ZXaiMs_PQxjRoQ9j

The Urantia Book - Universal Family: https://youtu.be/0K-bRZ-tazo?si=yi5Jjc4NNpYpf_yI


And it might be a good idea to join a UB study group to share in the experience of other readers and learn from their understanding. There's strength in numbers.

Take care,
Jon

[CAM7215]

Thank you for your kind and detailed response. Studied a Course in Miracles many moons ago --- thought adjuster comes to mind ... ACIM emphasizes LOVE and FEAR - as if that energy is the only energy in the universe. Just an observation.

What I liked about ACIM - lessons / training the brain to be fully aware and not accept reality for what our eyes tell us. There's a lot of folks that are (for lack of a better phrase) "the apathetic throng" and sleepwalk through life. Like the Matrix - HA! I believe it was "How to Know Higher Worlds" that explains our thoughts are powerful. Hey - correct me if I'm wrong but I have a feeling I am preaching to the choir about constructive and destructive patterns of though.

Sometimes it seems like so much effort -- almost regimented because I know the direction I want to go in. Let me take that back - the older I get, the less I struggle - and the more comfortable I feel in my own skin.

CAM

[Geoff]

Hi CAM,

The UB can be a lot to take in. Though I have just begun reading A Course in Miracles, I'm finding that it is more focused on the love of God. The Urantia Book shares this theme throughout. However, I think the UB may get deeper into the mechanics of it all, the technology of Spirit one might say.

I loved the ACIM, but I have to say JCIM made more sense to me, as they changed the words received to suit what they believed their audience could understand, but which left me bewildered. The thing is I do know the difference between "spirit" and "soul". However neither TUB not ACIM come remotely close to the Padgett Messages in the matter of God's Divine Love, seeing as that was the absolute total focus of four volumes or about 1,200 pages - yes I know TUB wins that pissing contest! But its rare for a TUB reader to read Padgett and equally vice versa. One is very intellectual and the other is very heart centred and experiential. After all Jesus does make the claim that IF you do xyz, then you WILL feel God's Divine Love. TUB merely tells you that you can feel God's Divine Love physically but no where does it explain HOW to do that nor WHY you should do that, and WHAT happens when you do not do that.

Geoff

[Amigoo]

For comparison to Padgett, this is what the UB teaches about love
(suggests difference in teaching style more than limited enlightenment).
From this perspective, the UB is indeed a bit "ïntellectual" and hints
that Padgett's perspective is good contrast, especially about love.

love See also: brotherhood (attitude)
ancients mistrusted l., sought tangible guarantee regarding marriage (83:3.1)
be purified through (182:1.5)
can turn into hate through disappointment, jealousy, resentment (177:4.11)
cannot be weighed in balance (196:3.18)

.divine love (2:5)
.. 4 reactions of fatherly love (140:5.15-23)
.. always looks for the best (140:5.12)
.. appears in mortal personality by ministry of Adjuster (117:6.10, 196:3.16)
.. circuit is from Father, through Sons to brothers, to Supreme (117:6.10)
.. credential of Jesus’ mission (137:6.5)
.. desire to do good to others (56:10.21)
.. divinity correlated in personality (0:1.17)
.. doubt not Father’s l. (143:2.7)

.. effect
... brings universal brotherhood into being (12:7.10)
... casts out all fear (48:6.8 )
... destroys hate and sin, all weakness resulting therefrom (188:5.2-3)
... he who dwells in l. dwells in God (3:1.5)
... infectious; more catching than hate (100:4.6, 188:5.1-2)
... operates directly in heart of individual (118:10.11)
... requires us to love as Jesus loves us (140:5.2,3, 181:2.30)
... saves the sinner (2:6.8 )
... triumph of l. in Lucifer rebellion (54:6)

.. essence of Jesus’ teaching (92:4.8 )
.. essence of religion; wellspring of civilization (102:6.3)
.. eternally creative (188:5.1-2)
.. evidence of spiritual rebirth (142:5.4, 143:2.3, 146:3.6, 196:3.7)
.. flows outward to creation through the Supreme (117:6.3)
.. follows us now and throughout eternal ages (2:5.9)
.. from God (117:6.10)
.. fruit of the Spirit (34:6.13)
.. fully perceived, is coincident with divine justice (10:6.18)
.. God is love (1:3.8, 2:5.1, 6:3, 8:4.2, 54:4.6, 56:10.20, 130:1.5, 134:4.1, 160:5.11)
.. God is love, but love is not God (2:5.10)
.. God loves not like a Father but as a father (2:6.4)
.. God’s greatest satisfaction is in loving, being loved (4:4.6)
.. grasping highest good of individual loved (180:5.10)

.. greatest of all spirit realities (56:10.20, 143:1.4, 143:6.4, 192:2.1, 196:3.29)
.. has severe disciplines (143:1.4)
.. intelligent and farseeing parental affection (2:5.9-10)
.. is source of parental love (21:0.2)
.. made real by loving each other (180:4.5)
.. mortals can feel undiminished impact of (3:4.6)
.. never self-seeking, cannot be self-bestowed (156:5.11)
.. not secondary to anything in God’s nature (188:4.8 )
.. not shortsighted affection which pampers, spoils (118:10.1)
.. outworking of divine urge of life (174:1.5)
.. portrays transcendent value of each personality (12:7.9)
.. seen in Father’s intrusting us with everything we might perform (32:4.10)
.. sum total of truth, beauty, and goodness (5:4.6, 56:10.17-21, 140:8.31)
.. true, holy, unlimited, eternal, and unique (40:10.13)
.. true guide to real insight (195:5.14)
.. volitional will of God (2:6.9)

domination by l. brought Adjuster prior to Spirit of Truth (108:2.9)
dove was symbol of (85:3.4)
experientially unify with divine law (42:11.1, 104:2.3, 111:6.6)
express in intelligent ministry (157:2.2)
fatherly l. transcends brotherly affection (140:5.5)
gives and craves affection (2:6.5)
immeasurable gulf between spiritual l. and thought (112:2.10)
l. with new and startling affection (191:6.2)

learning to love
.. by the grace of faith (191:4.3)
.. divine l. awakens l. in human heart (188:5.2)
.. each day learn to l. one more human being (100:4.6)
.. faith enhances (159:3.12)
.. freely give and receive l. (156:5.19)
.. greatest l. is to lay down life for friends (180:1.3, 188:5.7)
.. human l. is reciprocal (156:5.11)
... l. becomes real only when bestowed upon others (117:6.10)
... l. cannot be created, manufactured, or purchased; it must grow (100:3.7)
... l. is only born of thorough understanding of neighbor’s motives, sentiments (2:4.2, 100:4.4-6, 174:1.4-5)
.. learn to l. others by loving Father; becoming interested in others’ welfare (155:3.4, 181:2.5)
.. one cannot bring l. forth by act of will (100:4.6)
.. suspicion incompatible with l. (52:6.4)
.. the more we bestow ourselves upon our fellows, the more we l. them (129:0.2)
.. to share Master’s l., we must share his service (180:1.5)
.. very much a direct response to being loved (2:5.8, 56:8.3)

man’s nearest approach to God is through (3:4.7, 56:10.17)
man’s understanding of l. is only relatively true (115:1.2)
misconceptions of love
.. do not allow l. to become stumbling block (158:7.4)
.. human word symbol unfit (2:5.11)
.. illusory without truth, beauty, and goodness (196:3.21,29)
... l. for purpose of affectionate possession (127:6.1)
.. often dangerous, semiselfish trait in mortal parents (177:2.3)
.. selfish qualities of (100:2.4)

money cannot l. (127:2.8 )
mother l. is an adjutant mind-spirit instinct (84:1.6-7)
must dominate personality (100:4.3)
mutual regard of whole personalities; l. not the souls of men, but men themselves (112:2.7, 191:5.3)
not natural for man (16:9.7)
only a God-knowing person can l. others as himself (16:9.8 )
persons only l. and hate other persons (1:7.3, 2:6.8 )
prevents estrangements which necessitate repentance (174:1.2)
requires knowledge for human things; produces knowledge for divine things (102:1.1)
secret of beneficial association (12:9.2)
strengthens character, creates happiness (140:5.6)
subjective philosophic abstractions are devoid of (16:9.8 )
supplies soil for religious growth (100:0.2)
written examination cannot prove (103:8.3)

Rod

[CAM7215]

Far out, Geoff! Appreciate your perspective and Rod - you're brilliant! Appreciate your analytical / methodical nature. Just dying to know what YOU do for a living! On a Pink Cloud this week with the Akashic Construct & beginning the Urantia adventure.

It's a relief to know I don't have to guard my words in case I slip - aliens --- oops! Noah, my son, passed away April 20, 2020 - he was only 38 years old and died from an aortic dissection. Noah was on the autism spectrum --- didn't realize talking about alien life forms in a psychiatric session doesn't turn out well. That was ok because I sat through that session - sure enough --- that quack wanted to prescribe oodles of pills because (of course) my son was a schizophrenic. Bye, Felicia!

All of my kids are sensitive - my oldest may just be a healer. Helen is drawn to Reiki - she's clairvoyant and clairaudient BUT her take? "Mom I live here and need to do what I need to do. They've got to take care of their own business over there. So, if the energy gets too overwhelming or loud - she tells whomever to pipe down. Adam is 44 -- although he used to astral travel and have spiritual contact - he doesn't want to acknowledge that side of him. Mary is 40 and my baby - she's a free spirit and my only hippie child. Mary used to have posters of Jim Morrison on her walls and had a lava lamp. I did not realize but she has been using the Yellow Submarine movie to indoctrinate her daughters. Ava is 7 years old ---- begged her Mother to let her wear her Beatles t-shirt to school the other day.

I realize I overshare so skip over the boring parts or do like Noah - he never wanted to hurt anyone's feelings but pretty much faked listening in the car that's for sure. As I continue with the Akashic Construct -I will not be wound as tight with anxiety. I know my children are adults ---- but my grandchildren are little and I have concerns ... Truly it's about time for me to adopt a furry canine companion - Border Collie / Australian Shepard / Lab --- did I say Border Collie? The next project is putting up a fence in the backyard _ the shelter suggested tying the doggo outside ___ uh NO!

Patience isn't part of my skill set ---- training myself not to be so impulsive with my spending and adopting - HA! I don't know what I expected when I hit my 60s - that I would've learned all my lessons? Oh well - at least now I'm kinder to myself and don't care at all about what others think. I like this decade actually --- CAM

[Geoff]

For comparison to Padgett, this is what the UB teaches about love
(suggests difference in teaching style more than limited enlightenment).
From this perspective, the UB is indeed a bit "ïntellectual" and hints
that Padgett's perspective is good contrast, especially about love.

I dont wish to turn this into a bashing exercise, but to my mind there is ONLY one phrase in TUB that gets to what Padgett is all about. And no, nothing there that you have quoted Rod, comes close IMHO. I did my very best some time ago to compare these books. I have quoted that phrase before, its about Divine Love being something you can feel physically. What you have quoted is not at all far off plain orthodox Christian "love" teachings. But not Divine Love" which is entirely different in what it is.

BUT I suspect that its possible IF you already knew what you were looking for in TUB, to connect the dots. But I dont think its possible UNLESS you already have that Padgett mindset. I did collate the really good TUB passages here.

Lets start with a point many TUBer's deny. The "hells". They exist. Hence knowing the fastest way to get out is useful, but far better is HOW to avoid going there at all. Lets face it all of us have made mistakes in life. Its hard not to. In fact some people don't even know how serious are some of their behaviours. Background: Divine Love is a Higher Spiritual Law than the Law of Compensation.

Secondly. The mind cannot connect to God, and advancing your knowledge will not get you far in the mansion Worlds in a short period of time. But absorbing the maximum amount of Divine Love will. Even so I am talking years of effort on Earth. So it does not happen accidentally. Take Francis of Assisi - after all his efforts he entered in the 5th Mansion World. Mind you, that is astoundingly good, and yes friends of mine have done that too. But its super rare on this planet.

Thirdly TUB does not tell you the Sixth Mansion World is an intellectual dead end. You cannot progress from there to the Celestial.

Thats frankly enough. By the way one other difference is Jesus orchestrated the original Padgett Messages in 1914 and "came yet again" via three books in modern English talking about modern times - climate change - as recently as 2021. But because we practise mediumship - something the TUB denies is possible - we have a continuous 100 plus year connection with very high ranking Celestials.

take care
Geoff

[CAM7215]

That's it --- I am printing out this last page to be able to absorb this information. I am a hard copy and yellow highlighter gal and there's lots of good -- don't want to miss a thing. CAM

[Amigoo]

Thanks, Geoff

We're so disconnected on this Padgett vs UB topic! C'est la vie.
I'll need time to digest "the mind cannot connect to God".
And I need to work on why all this keeps suggesting that
Padgett's Jesus is not the Jesus of the UB.

Rod

[Geoff]

Thanks, Geoff

We're so disconnected on this Padgett vs UB topic! C'est la vie.
I'll need time to digest "the mind cannot connect to God".
And I need to work on why all this keeps suggesting that
Padgett's Jesus is not the Jesus of the UB.

Rod

The issue with the UB I have discussed. I realise its not something you would accept easily. It is from a 4D/5D source. That's too low to be teaching Jesus' stuff. Unless they actually knew him, and they would not have. Because they were living mortals in Andromeda. Nevertheless there are things in TUB that are on the money - I rate this passage

3:4.6 (50.4) Mortal man cannot possibly know the infinitude of the heavenly Father. Finite mind cannot think through such an absolute truth or fact. But this same finite human being can actually feel - literally experience - the full and undiminished impact of such an infinite Father’s LOVE. Such a love can be truly experienced, albeit while quality of experience is unlimited, quantity of such an experience is strictly limited by the human capacity for spiritual receptivity and by the associated capacity to love the Father in return.

More accurate in its communication of vital information that almost any passage in Padgett. In fact I don't think this bit: strictly limited by the human capacity for spiritual receptivity and by the associated capacity to love the Father in return is mentioned. Well its covered these days in very verbose (modern) messages. But I do like clear succinct communications myself.

But you certainly should know book 4 was not from the Andromedans. It came from a totally outside source, it came incomplete, and its to my mind a mixture of very good stuff (around the crucifixion) and very poor stuff - I find those stories of journeys cringeworthy. Our sources actually state that human input completed book 4! And that is totally supported by Anna's communications - Anna his grandmother. Her tale of HOW Jesus reached the heights of soul development is incredible. If I recall correctly his first solo spiritual adventure was at 7 years of age. I know he was supposed to be in Egypt at that time, so I don't know how that aligned, but he could have been taken to the mountains for that trial.

[Amigoo]

This following paragraph seems to confirm human sources for Part IV when the Midwayer Commission was satisified that the true story was told in those writings. Since the Midwayers essentially crafted Part IV (the life and teachings of Jesus), do the Padgett messages acknowledge Midwayer existence and participation in the UB manuscript? Seems to me, if there's any problem with Part IV, the buck stops with these Midwayers and their insinuated chutzpah in telling such a tall tale.

"ACTING under the supervision of a commission of twelve members of the United Brotherhood of Urantia Midwayers, conjointly sponsored by the presiding head of our order and the Melchizedek of record, I am the secondary midwayer of onetime attachment to the Apostle Andrew, and I am authorized to place on record the narrative of the life transactions of Jesus of Nazareth as they were observed by my order of earth creatures, and as they were subsequently partially recorded by the human subject of my temporal guardianship. Knowing how his Master so scrupulously avoided leaving written records behind him, Andrew steadfastly refused to multiply copies of his written narrative. A similar attitude on the part of the other apostles of Jesus greatly delayed the writing of the Gospels." (120:0.1)


Re: https://www.divinelovedivinetruth.org/james_e_padgett

"The trinity is a mistake of the writers of the bible. There is no trinity. Only One God, The Father. He is One and Alone."

This Padgett claim is such challenge to Christian theology that we must ask the following question
(after all, would a once-incarnated divine Son of God later teach that the trinity does not exist ?!):


Re: https://www.perplexity.ai/

Q: Who is the Jesus of Padgett's messages?

"According to the search results, James E. Padgett was a medium who received over 2,500 messages from various spirits, including Jesus of Nazareth, over the period of 1914 to 1923.The key points about the Jesus of Padgett's messages are:

Padgett initially doubted that the messages were actually from Jesus, as he found it 'absurd to think that Jesus of the Bible would come to write him any messages'. However, Padgett's close friends and the spirits themselves confirmed that the messages were indeed from Jesus.

The earliest message from Jesus to Padgett is dated September 28, 1914, and in it, Jesus urged Padgett to pray for Divine Love and shared other spiritual truths that Padgett found astounding as a Methodist.

Over the next nine years, Jesus communicated extensively with Padgett, with over 240 messages recorded from Jesus through Padgett.

These messages provide insight into who Jesus was 2,000 years ago and who he is today ...
according to the spiritual perspective channeled through Padgett.

The messages cover topics such as Jesus' relationship to God, the resurrection, forgiveness, immortality, and the human soul.

So in summary, the Jesus of Padgett's messages is portrayed as the historical Jesus of Nazareth, who communicated directly with Padgett over many years to share spiritual truths and insights."


These messages suggest, IMO, that Padgett was channeling (from whomever)
what would be known about those topics before the revelations of the UB Papers.
In the Papers we learn that Jesus (Michael) is not the Eternal Son of God,
which may explain why Padgett needed to deny the trinity (Eternal Son
was unknown then).

Apparently, there's no need to so closely associate
these two different perspectives of Jesus.


Rod

[Geoff]

Rod you seem not to have read all the many associated books around what happened in the Commission? One very credible individual claimed TUB was very nearly completely withdrawn, and all memories of it removed. Someone discarnate was very unhappy with the result. You see I don't just read the claimed material, I also read what those who were there have to say. Was that the midwayers or Melkizadeks? We dont know.

By the way that "excerpt" of Padgett does not even mention Divine Love. Thats incredible since its the thread running through everything. But AI simply grabs "reputed sources" - its choice of source. Even more incredible it rather says Padgett is about the man Jesus. Its not. Its about his teachings. So the source here is making the typical orthodox statements that Christianity is about the individual called Jesus and NOT his teachings.

But if you follow Padgett, as I do, it challenges the entire set of Orthodox teachings. Pretty much the only common agreement is that Jesus was crucified and was seen post death. So the denying the trinity is no big deal IMHO. But its of course means the blood of Jesus thingie cannot be. And we know its not a thingie, because Padgett channeled plenty of orthodox priests upset that the blood did not save them from hell.

But the Padgett Messages stands or falls on one message from Jesus. It is later, through a Jewish medium, not Padgett himself. I will quote it here, and bold the paragraph that is either true or false. And as TUB says its true... By all means jump to the bolded passage since I am truly not interested in minute disagreements. Geez I think the list of disagreements is far too long already? This is Jesus explaining what he said precisely when he announced that he was the messiah in the Temple in Jerusalem.

Revelation 5: Why Jesus was not accepted as the Messiah.
(This message is referred to as Revelation 9 on page 22 in New Testament Revelations of Jesus of Nazareth)



Jun 14th & Nov. 5th 1955

Received by Dr Samuels

Washington D.C.

I wish to continue with the truths of the New Testament and to speak about my teachings in the Temple in Jerusalem the autumn before my death, for it was the first time that I had the opportunity to present my claims as Messiah before the chief Priests and Rulers and most learned amongst the Hebrew people in matters pertaining to religion, and I made known that my mission was to proclaim the New Covenant between the Heavenly Father and the people of Israel, and that the Divine Love of the Father was now present and could be obtained by all who might seek it through earnest longing of soul, and that I was the visible sign of its presence, because in my soul there reposed the nature and essence of the Father in the form of the Divine Love, and that my soul was of this Nature and Essence of the Father and therefore Immortal.

But to the Hebrew rulers, my claims appeared false because Isaiah had prophesied that no one would know from whence the Messiah would come; whereas, I was well known - being Jesus of Nazareth, for they deemed a man not to be of his native town, but of the one in which he lived most of his life and was associated with; thus Jerusalem was considered the city of the “Great King David,” rather than Bethlehem, where he was born. The New Testament infers that the Hebrew leaders did not know I was born in Bethlehem - and that therefore Isaiah’s prophecy regarding the unknown origin of the Messiah was applicable to me, but the fact is, they not only knew where I was from, but they also knew my father, Joseph, a member of the Sanhedrin, and that he too came from Bethlehem.

This type of argument, however, showed bad faith and a recourse to technicalities in the determination of the priests not to recognize me as the Messiah, for that, they felt, would have upset their high position as the religious leaders of the nation, which they were unwilling to relinquish; and those technicalities were a subterfuge and manner of debating issues which were dear to their hearts, laying emphasis on hair splitting intellectual distinctions resulting from subtle interpretations of the law foreign to real basic issues and spiritual insight achieved through soul seeking to know the truth.

And thus, replying to their minute scriptural objections on their own terms, I proclaimed that it was not true that they knew where I was from, or who my Father was, for, whereas they referred to Joseph as my father, whom they knew well, I referred to God, my Heavenly Father, whom they did not know, nor did they know from whence I came as a Divine Soul, nor how or when I was created. The reference of the Rabbis to my father Joseph were later eliminated from the Gospels, for mention of my earthly parents was a thorn in the side of the later Gospel revisionists who labored zealously to make of me a God-man born of a virgin, and second person of the supposed trinity, which, of course, has no foundation in fact.

I further told them that, if they knew the Father, they would also know me, His Son, as being sent from Him, and recognize me as the Messiah, and quoting from Isaiah, as the Hebrew leaders did, I stated that the Father had said; “Incline your ear and come unto me; Hear, and your soul shall live, and I will make a covenant with you even the sure mercies of David. Behold, I have given him for a witness to the people, a leader and commander to the people.”

And this that I said, was known to all who received instruction concerning the Heavenly Father, so that they knew He had appointed a Messiah over them in a descendant of David, hence they should accept me as their Messiah, in as much as I had indeed come to enable their souls to live, by making available to them the gift of immortality in the Father’s Divine Love, accompanied by the power of healing and miracles which I performed through the Father, and thus attested to the truth of my mission.

And I further informed them, that, if they wished to assert the truth of my words, they should try and test my teachings that the Father’s Love was now available, and pray for it to the Father in earnest prayer, and see whether, if this was done in sincerity, the Father’s Love, conveyed through the Holy Spirit, would burn and glow in the soul, by which sign they would realize His Love was present therein.

And I also stated that these teachings were not mine, but those of the Father - which I had been commanded by Him to proclaim to the children of Israel, and that, having been sent by Him, I could do nothing of my own, but what I saw done unto me by the Father - that is to say, what power I received of the Father. I did not say I could do what I saw the Father do, or imitate Him, as the Gospel states, for that would give me a power equal to that of the Father, which is blasphemy, for no mortal or spirit will ever, through all eternity, have power equal to that of the Father, and the revision was made many years later in conformity to the false doctrine, elaborated in the early Greek period of Christianity, after my death, of making me co-equal to the Father; and here would like to say that, if such an absurdity were admitted for one moment, it lends itself to its own destruction, and proves its own falsity, for, never having seen the Heavenly Father lay down His life for His sheep, Israel, neither could I, Jesus, have laid down mine, in the sense that it is understood in the New Testament, that my shed blood and sacrifice on the cross gives remission of sins.

I quote from the Psalms and from Samuel the prophet on the Davidic covenant, saying, “I will set up thy seed after thee which shall proceed out of thy bowels and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build a house for my name, I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever, I will be his Father, and he shall be my son.”

Thus if they knew the Father and honored His word, they would know me as well for I proclaimed the eternal salvation of the soul through His Love, which was evidenced in my own soul and witnessed to by His power acting through me. I also testified that while they did not know the Father, I, indeed, knew Him and was sent by Him - and I stated that God was my witness to the truth of my mission - a mission which I undertook for His glory, and not my own.

Neither did I break the Mosaic law regarding the Sabbath, when I healed and made whole one of the Father’s children on that day, for if circumcision was superior to the Sabbath, wherein one member of the body was restored, how much more important than the Sabbath was that act wherein the whole body was restored?

Hence I stated that their rejection of me as the Messiah, on the grounds of my having healed on the Sabbath day, was merely a subterfuge to refuse me recognition and to conceal their own violation of the Mosaic law - making one body member more important than the body itself, and it was they, not I, who was guilty of transgression. I further stated that even as the Father knew and was in me through having bestowed upon me the gift of His Love through response to my soul aspirations and prayer, and this Love was His nature and essence, even so did I know the Father and in the same way was in Him.

I never said I was the Good Shepherd, for that referred to the Father, and this statement was inserted many years after my death, in order to raise me up to being equal to God. Instead, I stated that the Father is the Good Shepherd - the sheepfold being the Kingdom of Heaven, and that I was the door through which the sheep came into the sheepfold and into the presence and knowledge of the Shepherd, or the Porter, who opens the door and is the Father. The Father gives Eternal life to His sheep, and I am the way, the door, by which the sheep may enter the sheepfold of eternal life. In the Psalms it was pointed out that the Good Shepherd, God, would use David, or, better said, a root of David, as a helper in bringing the sheep into the fold.

I think I have said enough on this subject and have explained many things that are obscure in the New Testament, and with my blessings upon you and the Doctor, and upon all my disciples who are doing the Father’s work, I shall stop and sign myself,

Jesus of the Bible

and

Master of the Celestial Heavens

[Amigoo]

Thanks, Geoff!

"Jesus of the Bible and Master of the Celestial Heavens'"
... is good contrast to ...
"Jesus of the Urantia Book and Master Son of our local universe"

I should read more of the Padgett messages before posting again on this topic.
However, the insignificance of the trinity is mind-boggling contrast to the UB's story
of universe cosmology and spirituality since the trinity is so integral to that story:

"The Paradise Trinity is real. It exists as the Deity union of Father, Son, and Spirit ...
The Trinity is so related to total universe affairs that it must be reckoned with in our attempts
to explain the totality of any isolated cosmic event or personality relationship. The Trinity functions
on all levels of the cosmos, and mortal man is limited to the finite level ... As a mortal in the flesh
you should view the Trinity in accordance with your individual enlightenment and in harmony with
the reactions of your mind and soul ... as you ascend Paradiseward, you will many times experience
astonishment at successive revelations and unexpected discoveries of Trinity supremacy
and ultimacy, if not of absoluteness." (10:4.4-7)

Rod

[Geoff]

Hi Rod,

The issue with orthodox Christianity is it claims Jesus is God - actually Prime Source. He has said many times in Padgett he is not and further explained that it is blasphemy to worship him. That is why the "Trinity" is denied in Padgett because that is the only version of trinity that 98% of humans on this planet would explain to you.

As for what is found in TUB, I decided 22 years ago that it was really unimportant to me if God is so complex or is in fact singular. It will be many thousands of years I suspect before that might be of interest and relevance. Perhaps it never will be? And I have to say that having had the "Thought Adjuster" concept debunked, I cannot place a great of reliance on what has come out of the minds of beings that are mostly mindal and of very limited soul development. As Jesus has explained many times, only soul can understand God, so without that soul development, its pointless to conjecture. By the way several of my friends have been met by the Master on their death. That is certainly some form of verification. These messages are located in one place -Departed Friends

The term "Master of the Celestial Heavens'" can be very important when a medium claims he/she is hearing from Jesus. There are many imposters, indeed books have been written that were not sourced by him. That statement reverberates throughout the Celestial Kingdom and will mean that the imposter is sent packing. Padgett was tested deliberately by his guides because it is only energy signatures that give any indication of who is coming through. Padgett passed all tests.

[Amigoo]

... having had the "Thought Adjuster" concept debunked, I cannot place a great of reliance on what has come out of the minds of beings that are mostly mindal and of very limited soul development. As Jesus has explained many times, only soul can understand God, so without that soul development, its pointless to conjecture.

With the UB instructing that the Adjuster (God's presence within the human mind) helps develop the soul,
I'm effectively informed to wear my seat belt when reading more of Padgett, such is this mind-boggling
concept debunking and other Padgett perspective.

Rod

[Amigoo]

With 1111angels being the host of this discussion, does Padgett mention Midwayers?
Apparently, the UB and 1111angels are the only sources of this information ...
and Midwayer time prompting is only revealed in this 1111angels site.


Re: https://www.perplexity.ai/

Q: What non-human beings (angels and other spirits) are revealed in the James Padgett messages?

"According to the search results, the James Padgett messages reveal the existence of several non-human beings, including:

Spirits: The messages indicate that spirits of deceased humans can communicate with the living and recall their human existence.
The messages state that these spirits are around us, trying to influence us, and that we can pray for their loving influences.

Celestial Angels: The messages explain that through prayer, we can request that Celestial Angels offer their loving influences
to family and friends who have entered the spirit world.

Bright Spirits: The messages describe 'bright spirits' that can go and speak to troubled spirits in the afterlife,
or provide loving influence to those in darkness.

God's Divine Love: The messages convey that God's Divine Love is available to all,
even those in the 'deepest hells' of the afterlife.

So in summary, the Padgett messages reveal the existence of spirits of the deceased, Celestial Angels, 'bright spirits',
and the pervasive presence of God's Divine Love, all of which can interact with and influence the living."

Rod

[Geoff]

With 1111angels being the host of this discussion, does Padgett mention Midwayers?
Apparently, the UB and 1111angels are the only sources of this information ...

No and you certainly have a point. More seriously, and please note I do not subscribe to this interpretation, there is a message or perhaps 2 that claim "there never were any fallen angels" eg Lucifer. It is the case that many reading Padgett might still think that we are the only humanoid race, and other than good angels and dead Earth humans, that's it for the discarnate world. But if you do ever get to peruse my site you will generally find I am apt to add a comment when I don't agree with something. Mediumship is a somewhat dodgy business. Yes we have been trained in soul to soul communication, but for words to end up on a page, those inevitably have to do through a mind which can indeed mess things up.

Now the closest we ever had to "one of us" and midwayers was when I was present at the first Australian Divine Love retreat, and Al Fike saw a midwayer, got scared and said it was "not loving". In the end I realised what he meant was he could not detect the energy that emanates from Celestial humans. And that's not surprising is it? But his conclusion was way off the mark. By the way Al Fike is now regularly channeling "Orion". Nothing massively ground breaking there. We have had the occasional visit from a space person over the years.

Here is a typical comment:

I have with me a great number of spirits who have received the Great Love of the Father in great abundance, and who are so good and beautiful that they are as of the Father. And here I must tell you that all angels in His Kingdom, which is ruled over by Jesus, are the spirits of mortals who once lived on earth, and not what the Old Testament called angels are. I am informed there are beings who never had the experience of living in the flesh. I have never seen any of these angels and I don’t know where they live, but Jesus says they are a distinct class of God’s creation, and that they live in spheres that are separated from the heavens that he rules in. I have often wished to see some of these angels, but it does not appear that they ever come to our Celestial Heavens.

This I always found odd, but as TUB indicates the "Celestial" is complex, and I recently had a go at aligning the concept of Mansion Worlds with these places, but I know you, Rod, are as yet not happy with "dimensions". However I now see that there are many different "realms" or what it appears should be called "dimensions."

The purpose of TUB was a very complete overview of things. Even so its not complete. Because that is beyond a mere 2,000 pages. Padgett was simply to teach of the existence of Divine Love, how to obtain it, why you should, what happens if you do not etc.

Geoff

[Amigoo]

Thanks, Geoff!

For me, 'realms' is a good substitute for 'dimensions'
since 'realms' is not so definitive of spacetime regions
that are more theoretical to human experience.

If you experience time prompting is that proof of Midwayers?

Is this UB quote not related to the indwelling Thought Adjuster?

"Unless a divine lover lived in man, he could not unselfishly and spiritually love." (196:3.16)

Rod

[Geoff]

If you experience time prompting
is that proof of Midwayers?

Rod

Not anymore because many discarnates have taken up the challenge of awakening all of "Progress". All those folks who are progress not churches. There were too many for the 1,111 to deal with. Of course later we got foreign midwayers like Mathew 333.

But I had way too many experiences to deny Bzutu (aka ABC22). Probably can't remember the half of them, but I KNOW he exists, is a midwayer and was not with Lucifer. Then too, I recall Dr Mendoza (MNO8) going with George to resolve the pneumonia Janet had post an 11 hour back fusion operation. In the end George fixed her lungs himself.

[Amigoo]

Re: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxlqH4_hRXA (to be presented May 5)
"Can Quantum Physicists and Buddhists Agree on Consciousness?"

Re: https://www.perplexity.ai/

Q: Is consciousness possible with quantum computers?

"Based on the search results provided, it appears that the possibility of consciousness being explained by quantum mechanics and quantum computers is an active area of research and debate in the scientific community: The search results suggest that some scientists believe consciousness may rely on quantum entanglement and quantum processes in the brain. The idea is that quantum phenomena like superposition and entanglement could underlie the brain's powerful information processing capabilities and even consciousness itself. Specifically, the search results discuss two main theories:

The Extended Everett's Concept (EEC) - This theory proposes that consciousness separates the alternative realities described by the many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics, and that our everyday experience is just one of the infinite possible realities.

Matthew Fisher's concept - This theory suggests that certain molecules in the brain, like Posner clusters, could act as qubits and enable quantum information processing that contributes to cognition and consciousness.

However, the search results also note that experimentally demonstrating and proving these quantum consciousness theories remains a major challenge with current technology. Some researchers caution that the brain may not actually operate as a quantum computer, and alternative explanations for the observed phenomena are possible. Overall, the search results indicate that the relationship between quantum mechanics, quantum computers, and consciousness is an active area of research with intriguing hypotheses, but no definitive conclusions have been reached yet. More research is needed to determine if and how quantum processes may underlie or contribute to human consciousness."


The UB explains that consciousness is a feature of mind - not brain, suggesting computers need this same mind bestowal:

"Mortal mind is a temporary intellect system loaned to human beings for use during a material lifetime, and as they use this mind, they are either accepting or rejecting the potential of eternal existence. Mind is about all you have of universe reality that is subject to your will, and the soul - the morontia self - will faithfully portray the harvest of the temporal decisions which the mortal self is making. Human consciousness (facilitated by mind) rests gently upon the electrochemical mechanism below (brain) and delicately touches the spirit-morontia energy system above. Of neither of these two systems is the human being ever completely conscious in his mortal life; therefore must he work in mind, of which he is conscious... " (111:1.5)


Of course, this still permits "Quantum Physicists and Buddhists to Agree on Consciousness" (as they understand it). Interestingly, Buddhism's "not self" mind is conceptually close to the UB's "divinity bestowed mind". And "Western conception of a unitary, independent self or soul" is close but doesn't acknowledge divinity bestowed mind during the early life of that soul.

Re: https://www.perplexity.ai/

Q: What is mind in Buddhism?

"According to the search results, the Buddhist perspective on the nature of mind can be summarized as follows:

The Buddhist view of mind is quite different from the Western conception of a unitary, independent self or soul. Rather, Buddhists see the mind as a collection of interrelated mental faculties and processes, without a permanent, independent self at the core. The key Buddhist doctrine related to the nature of mind is the doctrine of 'not-self' (anatta/anātma), which holds that human beings are reducible to the physical and psychological constituents that make them up, without an essential, enduring self.

The main Buddhist terms used to refer to the mind are citta (mind or thought), manas (mental domain), and vijñāna (consciousness or discernment). These terms denote different aspects of the mental domain, such as the subjective, cognitive, and perceptual faculties. Buddhists see the mind as a 'formless continuum' that functions to perceive and understand objects, rather than as a physical part of the body like the brain.

The mind is considered to be intimately connected to the workings of karma and the cycle of rebirth. Buddhist texts describe different levels or layers of consciousness, including mind consciousness, sense consciousness, and a deeper 'store consciousness' (ālaya-vijñāna). Meditation is seen as a way to understand and transform these different levels of mind.

Overall, the Buddhist view of mind emphasizes its impermanent, non-dual, and interdependent nature, in contrast to the notion of a unitary, independent self."


Rod

[Amigoo]

Paper 147 in the news ...

Re: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ar-AA1bxupt (May, 2023)
"Scientists say they have found a chapter of the Bible hidden under a section of text for more than a thousand years"

"... according to the release, the original Greek version of Matthew 12:1 - which is the one most commonly used today - said, 'At that time Jesus went through the grainfields on the Sabbath, and his disciples became hungry and began to pick the heads of grain and eat.'

The newly discovered Syriac translation, however, is slightly different. It said, 'began to pick the heads of grain, rub them in their hands, and eat them.' "


Note how the UB author of Paper 147 embellishes the event, creating (recalling?) much dialogue comparable to the Syriac translation and that is not written the in KJV Bible nor in the sources mentioned in the Parallel studies: https://urantiabooksources.com/wp-conte ... 11/147.pdf

Paper 147 - The Interlude Visit to Jerusalem
6. Returning to Capernaum

"But the spies did not have long to wait for their opportunity to accuse Jesus and his associates of Sabbath breaking. As the company passed along the narrow road, the waving wheat, which was just then ripening, was near at hand on either side, and some of the apostles, being hungry, plucked the ripe grain and ate it. It was customary for travelers to help themselves to grain as they passed along the road, and therefore no thought of wrongdoing was attached to such conduct. But the spies seized upon this as a pretext for assailing Jesus.

When they saw Andrew rub the grain in his hand, they went up to him and said: 'Do you not know that it is unlawful to pluck and rub the grain on the Sabbath day?' And Andrew answered: 'But we are hungry and rub only sufficient for our needs; and since when did it become sinful to eat grain on the Sabbath day?' But the Pharisees answered: 'You do no wrong in eating, but you do break the law in plucking and rubbing out the grain between your hands; surely your Master would not approve of such acts.'

Then said Andrew: 'But if it is not wrong to eat the grain, surely the rubbing out between our hands is hardly more work than the chewing of the grain, which you allow; wherefore do you quibble over such trifles?' When Andrew intimated that they were quibblers, they were indignant, and rushing back to where Jesus walked along, talking to Matthew, they protested, saying: 'Behold, Teacher, your apostles do that which is unlawful on the Sabbath day; they pluck, rub, and eat the grain. We are sure you will command them to cease.'

And then said Jesus to the accusers: 'You are indeed zealous for the law, and you do well to remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy; but did you never read in the Scripture that, one day when David was hungry, he and they who were with him entered the house of God and ate the showbread, which it was not lawful for anyone to eat save the priests? and David also gave this bread to those who were with him. And have you not read in our law that it is lawful to do many needful things on the Sabbath day? And shall I not, before the day is finished, see you eat that which you have brought along for the needs of this day?

My good men, you do well to be zealous for the Sabbath, but you would do better to guard the health and well-being of your fellows. I declare that the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath. And if you are here present with us to watch my words, then will I openly proclaim that the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath.' " (147:6.4)


Rod

[Amigoo]

I was curious if this AI had "revelatory" perspective ...

Re: https://www.perplexity.ai/

Q: What is the source of the word "morontia"?

"The word 'morontia' is a coined term introduced in The Urantia Book, a spiritual and philosophical book published in 1955. It refers to a level of reality that exists between the material and spiritual realms. According to The Urantia Book, 'morontia' designates a vast level intervening between the purely physical material realm and the purely spiritual realm. It describes a state of progressive reality, emerging from the material and becoming spiritual. The etymology of the word suggests it means 'that which is akin to matter' - 'mor' meaning matter and '-ontia' meaning akin to.

The Urantia Book explains that morontia is a phase of energy and matter that bridges the gap between the visible material world and the invisible spiritual world. It states that just as water can exist in solid, liquid, and gaseous states, energy and matter also exist in material, morontial, and spiritual phases. Morontia elements are said to number around 200, compared to the 100 or so natural elements of the material world.

So in essence, the word 'morontia' was coined by the authors of The Urantia Book to describe an intermediary realm of existence between the purely physical and purely spiritual realms. It is a unique concept introduced in that book to explain the transition from material to spiritual reality."

Rod