Dreams & Midwayers

[DJKENZ]

Howdy doodie tutti frootie folks!
this topic is an attempt to solidify my understanding of the source & purpose of dreams.
I'm not trying to interpret dreams here but more to get feedback from people who believe
they have the facts/truth.

Ok so researchers have said
1) Dreams are necessary as the brain sorts & stores the human's experiences during sleep.
I read somewhere in the 11:11 progress group emails or on this board that
2) The Destiny Guardian spirits (I think) sometimes create dreams for you as well
3) Visions can occur during dreams..
but whose generates these?
In Lucid dreaming (in which you realize you're dreaming,) who creates the storyline
or does the human's consciousness attempt to play a part in the sorting/storing by the brain
or play a part in a dream ceated by the destiny guardians?

[LolaandLight]

It is interesting that you post this because I have had some really odd dreams over the last couple of days. All of them center around animals. I have a close connection with animals. So, I figure that these dreams have special signifigance.

[happyrain]

3) Visions can occur during dreams..
but whose generates these?
?

i am wondering something similar. sometimes there are moments in our lives when we are cued of a dream in the past- whether it is exact or relates on a symbolic level- the fact that such an instance would occur(remembrance of the dream) makes you wonder... why? could it be the marking of an important step regarding one's own personal journey? aside from why- it makes me wonder... who? assistance...?

cheers

[Twinstars]

I get much input by way of dreams. I have a close working relationship with my teachers and guides. I have asked that they come into my dreams with any and all pertinent input, whether it be for my own well-being or that of anyone whom they see as soon to cross my path. I value their input more all the time, to the point where I nearly always hesitate before I speak. But, not always. I also try to linger now before making important decisions.

In answer to DJKENZ' question:

3) Visions can occur during dreams..
but who generates these?
In Lucid dreaming (in which you realize you're dreaming,) who creates the storyline
or does the human's consciousness attempt to play a part in the sorting/storing by the brain
or play a part in a dream created by the destiny guardians?

The answer I was going to offer is that it must be input by the TA. That is, until I found the following:

UB PAPER 110: RELATION OF ADJUSTERS TO INDIVIDUAL MORTALS
Solitary Messenger.
110:5.2 Man's dream experiences, that disordered and disconnected parade of the un-co-ordinated sleeping mind, present adequate proof of the failure of the Adjusters to harmonize and associate the divergent factors of the mind of man. The Adjusters simply cannot, in a single lifetime, arbitrarily co-ordinate and synchronize two such unlike and diverse types of thinking as the human and the divine. When they do, as they sometimes have, such souls are translated directly to the mansion worlds without the necessity of passing through the experience of death.
110:5.3 During the slumber season the Adjuster attempts to achieve only that which the will of the indwelt personality has previously fully approved by the decisions and choosings which were made during times of fully wakeful consciousness, and which have thereby become lodged in the realms of the supermind, the liaison domain of human and divine interrelationship.
110:5.4 While their mortal hosts are asleep, the Adjusters try to register their creations in the higher levels of the material mind, and some of your grotesque dreams indicate their failure to make efficient contact. The absurdities of dream life not only testify to pressure of unexpressed emotions but also bear witness to the horrible distortion of the representations of the spiritual concepts presented by the Adjusters. Your own passions, urges, and other innate tendencies translate themselves into the picture and substitute their unexpressed desires for the divine messages which the indwellers are endeavoring to put into the psychic records during unconscious sleep.
110:5.5 It is extremely dangerous to postulate as to the Adjuster content of the dream life. The Adjusters do work during sleep, but your ordinary dream experiences are purely physiologic and psychologic phenomena. Likewise, it is hazardous to attempt the differentiation of the Adjusters' concept registry from the more or less continuous and conscious reception of the dictations of mortal conscience. These are problems which will have to be solved through individual discrimination and personal decision. But a human being would do better to err in rejecting an Adjuster's expression through believing it to be a purely human experience than to blunder into exalting a reaction of the mortal mind to the sphere of divine dignity. Remember, the influence of a Thought Adjuster is for the most part, though not wholly, a superconscious experience...

[Presented by a Solitary Messenger of Orvonton.]

[DJKENZ]

Twinstars,
buddy, you hit the nail-on-the-head with what my intention was with the posting of my topic!!
Thank you SO very much. I do not recall hearing that passage at all in the UB audiobooks. I must've missed it.

wow...phew...so this was very enlightening & revealing...no doubt
and it certainly had a strong warning along with it.
What I gather from it is that the SOURCE and PURPOSE of dreams is
1) either the Adjuster actively trying to post our experiences into the Akashic Records or
2) Merely the mortal mind reflecting on the day's doings or on the past.

This is clearly more complicated/deeper than I had expected dreams to be.
I do notice that the passage does not talk about the Destiny Guardians who I read
somewhere within the 11:11 framework that they 'create' dreams (sometimes?)
That's odd as this passage would've havee been an appropriate place to do so.
I've got a good handle on Lucid Dreaming which I trained myself to achieve using
my own Hypnosis mp3s but the question remains..

For those of us that are thick-headed (like me, ) can we use the sleep state
for a systematic, conscious communication (using Lucid Dreaming) with the midwayers
or is the Alpha State the only way to make this possible?

Thank you for challenging as well as answering my thought process.
You Rock Bro!

[LolaandLight]

Could someone translate the UB passage for me? I just am not getting it. It seems to be saying that dreams are not as important as the meaning we humans tend to give them at times. That they are not necessarily messages from "beyond". But, I cannot really say that I get the explanation of what they are.

[Twinstars]

I too am learning, thanks for the opportunity.

Found a few words that pertain to:

UB Paper 113: SERAPHIC GUARDIANS OF DESTINY
113:4.3 Seraphim function as teachers of men by guiding the footsteps of the human personality into paths of new and progressive
113:5.1 Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind; they do not manipulate the will of mortals; neither do they directly contact with the indwelling Adjusters. The guardian of destiny influences you in every possible manner consistent with the dignity of your personality; under no circumstances do these angels interfere with the free action of the human will. Neither angels nor any other order of universe personality have power or authority to curtail or abridge the prerogatives of human choosing.
113:5.2 Angels are so near you and care so feelingly for you that they figuratively " weep because of your willful intolerance and stubbornness. " Seraphim do not shed physical tears; they do not have physical bodies; neither do they possess wings. But they do have spiritual emotions, and they do experience feelings and sentiments of a spiritual nature which are in certain ways comparable to human emotions.
113:5.3 The seraphim act in your behalf quite independent of your direct appeals; they are executing the mandates of their superiors, and thus they function regardless of your passing whims or changing moods. This does not imply that you may not make their tasks either easier or more difficult, but rather that angels are not directly concerned with your appeals or with your prayers.
113:5.4 In the life of the flesh the intelligence of angels is not directly available to mortal men. They are not overlords or directors; they are simply guardians. The seraphim guard you; they do not seek directly to influence you; you must chart your own course, but these angels then act to make the best possible use of the course you have chosen. They do not (ordinarily) arbitrarily intervene in the routine affairs of human life. But when they receive instructions from their superiors to perform some unusual exploit, you may rest assured that these guardians will find some means of carrying out these mandates. They do not, therefore, intrude into the picture of human drama except in emergencies and then usually on the direct orders of their superiors. They are the beings who are going to follow you for many an age, and they are thus receiving an introduction to their future work and personality association.
113:5.5 Seraphim are able to function as material ministers to human beings under certain circumstances, but their action in this capacity is very rare. They are able, with the assistance of the midway creatures and the physical controllers, to function in a wide range of activities in behalf of human beings, even to make actual contact with mankind, but such occurrences are very unusual. In most instances the circumstances of the material realm proceed unaltered by seraphic action, although occasions have arisen, involving jeopardy to vital links in the chain of human evolution, in which seraphic guardians have acted, and properly, on their own initiative.

LolaandLight, what you wrote:

It seems to be saying that dreams are not as important as the meaning we humans tend to give them at times. That they are not necessarily messages from "beyond". But, I cannot really say that I get the explanation of what they are.

I would say that "at times" is much of what is being conveyed. Although I believe beyond a shadow that my teachers, and guides Do converse with me in my dreams, because I have asked them to, sometimes with messages form beyond, I also believe that what I refer to as "nonsense dreams" are nothing more than information being recorded then released from the mind of my Thought Adjuster, filtered out of the superconsciousness through the release of emotions while dreaming.

Hope this helps,
We All Rock.

[LolaandLight]

Twinstars,

Thank you. I was a bit dismayed reading the exerpt because I have had dreams that, after looking them up in a dream book, the dream had a message that I very much needed to hear and the message came true.

[Sandy]

Hi Guys,

This jumped out at me in twinstar's Ubook quotes...

Angels do not invade the sanctity of the human mind; they do not manipulate the will of mortals; neither do they directly contact with the indwelling Adjusters.

Here are a few other quotes, though....
page 1245 Paper 113 Seraphic Guardians of Destiny http://www.urantia.org/en/urantia-book- ... ns-destiny

While there is apparently no communication between the indwelling Adjusters and the encompassing seraphim, they always seem to work in perfect harmony and exquisite accord. The guardians are most active at those times when the Adjusters are least active, but their ministry is in some manner strangely correlated. Such superb co-operation could hardly be either accidental or incidental.

(1245.6) 113:4.6 The ministering personality of the guardian seraphim, the God presence of the indwelling Adjuster, the encircuited action of the Holy Spirit, and the Son-consciousness of the Spirit of Truth are all divinely correlated into a meaningful unity of spiritual ministry in and to a mortal personality. Though hailing from different sources and different levels, these celestial influences are all integrated in the enveloping and evolving presence of the Supreme Being.

and here again... page 1191 Paper 108 Mission And Ministry Of Thought Adjusters http://www.urantia.org/en/urantia-book- ... -adjusters

(1190.4) 108:4.3 Thought Adjusters appear to come and go quite independent of any and all other spiritual presences; they seem to function in accordance with universe laws quite apart from those which govern and control the performances of all other spirit influences. But regardless of such apparent independence, long-range observation unquestionably discloses that they function in the human mind in perfect synchrony and co-ordination with all other spirit ministries, including adjutant mind-spirits, Holy Spirit, Spirit of Truth, and other influences.

(1190.5) 108:4.4 When a world is isolated by rebellion, when a planet is cut off from all outside encircuited communication, as was Urantia after the Caligastia upheaval, aside from personal messengers there remains but one possibility of direct interplanetary or universe communication, and that is through the liaison of the Adjusters of the spheres. No matter what happens on a world or in a universe, the Adjusters are never directly concerned. The isolation of a planet in no way affects the Adjusters and their ability to communicate with any part of the local universe, superuniverse, or the central universe. And this is the reason why contacts with the supreme and the self-acting Adjusters of the reserve corps of destiny are so frequently made on quarantined worlds. Recourse is had to such a technique as a means of circumventing the handicaps of planetary isolation. In recent years the archangels’ circuit has functioned on Urantia, but that means of communication is largely limited to the transactions of the archangel corps itself.

(1191.1) 108:4.5 We are cognizant of many spirit phenomena in the far-flung universe which we are at a loss fully to understand. We are not yet masters of all that is transpiring about us; and I believe that much of this inscrutable work is wrought by the Gravity Messengers and certain types of Mystery Monitors. I do not believe that Adjusters are devoted solely to the remaking of mortal minds. I am persuaded that the Personalized Monitors and other orders of unrevealed prepersonal spirits are representative of the Universal Father’s direct and unexplained contact with the creatures of the realms.

I love much of the Urantia book yet it was written well before the advent of the adjudication of the Lucifer Rebellion and the advent of the Correcting Time. All the stops have been pulled out by our "Elder Siblings" in an effort to raise human spirituality on this world. It seems these two quotes from the book itself leave you wondering precisely what is the right of it... and admittedly much is left to speculations about Thought Adjusters. hmmm so I must say that in my simple opinion I suppose...Thought Adjusters, being parts of God should be able to speak to whatever being is capable of understanding in an effort to raise their own charge's spirituality as it falls within their self determined orders and designed function.

In addition, I believe as each of us progress and with the additional mind endowments gifted to us along with this self same progress we will be able to step out of the box of norms. This is not a normal world...unique in many respects in all of Nebaddon. Twinstar...you have raised the bar and continue to do so with your complete trust and faith as you work along side your TA, angels, and guides. I have no doubt whatsoever that you are guided in your dreams as you indicated.
We are children of God and because of that are cabable of reflecting the same powerful energies for good of that of our Parent. In other words...we can do anything...amazing things.... as we step forward and claim our Divine Inheritance.

Love,
Sandy

[George]

Sandy writes:

I love much of the Urantia book yet it was written well before the advent of the adjudication of the Lucifer Rebellion and the advent of the Correcting Time. All the stops have been pulled out by our "Elder Siblings" in an effort to raise human spirituality on this world.

Amen! There are almost 2000 of Lytske's Thought Adjuster transmissions, even a few from me, but quite some Destiny Guardians transmissions. As well, there is contact with the Cherubim, "I'll be Frank" and Alice. The Correcting Time is gradually outdating the 1950's UBook truth, and we were told that would happen.

A time will come when a new commission -- mortal and celestial -- will collate all relevant new channeled truth, and update the UB text. Could be some of Teacher Samuel's minor revelations in there.

BTW. Last weekend we witnessed a 4-year-old having a two-way conversation with a Cherub or Midwayer.

God bless...
George.

[LolaandLight]

A time will come when a new commission -- mortal and celestial -- will collate all relevant new channeled truth, and update the UB text. Could be some of Teacher Samuel's minor revelations in there.

So, George, this shifting and changing that I feel, or sense, as something "big" going on out in the something or another (as from my understanding, though I have never put it to words, there is no "heaven" there is no "Earth" in the manner in which we view it, there is only the Mind of God, and there are shifts as understanding expands in the mind and heart of man, or lessens, withdraws) could be really something that is going on? (Did that make sense to anyone?)

I am so very confused as it seems at times as if my life is not my life. That it is not for mortal purposes, all these memories of being a spot of light and floating in front of God, walking with this man with white hair and a beard only the "me" walking with him is not the "me" in the literal, physical sense of "me", and then, in the midst of this, trying to find a job in this crazy economy, trying to reconcile life with Light. I know, try to meditate, ask for guidance, for understanding. Well, when I do, I get the feeling that the ceiling above my head is about to peel away and reveal God's face. Okay, folks, pack me up, I am ready for the looney bin.

[Twinstars]

Thank you Sandy, More input is, as a certain Celestial friend so eloquently put it, "Alright!" Won't that be the day when we can read an updated Ubook!

Thank you George, I recall daily your sage words "Nothing in this Universe should surprise..." Now when reading of,

a 4-year-old having a two-way conversation with a Cherub or Midwayer

I'm filled only with joy and optimism for a brighter future. Amen!

Love All, enjoying my special place in the Son,
John

[LolaandLight]

Could someone explain to me maybe why I have memories of attending these universities the Celestial Beings talk about?

[George]

Lola writes:

Could someone explain to me maybe why I have memories of attending these universities the Celestial Beings talk about?

I have them, too, and many a times I've met up with Prince Machiventa -- not my body, brain or soul, but my TA and mind.

It's nothing to worry about. It's soul growth.


George.

[LolaandLight]

George,

Your reply greatly helps, believe me. Now, this is a stupid question, what did you mean by soul growth? See, I think that at least part of my job is to pull "over there" into over here. I mean, it includes learning to control my emotions, behaviors, thoughts, all of that. But, to walk all the time with "them" in my consciousnes. Perhaps that is why they wont leave me alone enough to meditate, or that I wont leave me alone to meditate. The connection is to be a live wire at all times is about the best way that I can put it. I also (sorry I run on so much I just feel like a have a very limited amount of time to get this right) think that the memories of "studying" has this thing in me making me think I should be following a distinct course of study or something. So, saying soul growth to me means that I am on that path. I am too literal aren't I?

[George]

Dear Lola,

To me you sound somewhat stressed, when your real mission is to live your life as best you can, but with such continued input it would be best to write, write daily, and keep a record, because these tend to "grow" into lessons.

I'm talking about journaling.

Hugs...
me

[LolaandLight]

Thank you George.

This is the thing, when they come, it is more of an image in my mind and it is very hard to translate what they "give me" into words at times. It can come and go so quickly. For instance, I walk into a office and I am told "be careful" or like since you gave your last reply, I have the feeling that someone new is with me that is more immediate to my contact (if that makes sense) like a coach. I so much need someone to give me positive feedback about me and my ability to contribute and give, to be of value. If you knew all the crazy mess I have stepped into in my life, you would understand. Trying to love and give I screwed up my life. I don't think I screwed up my soul. But, I made my life very difficult and insecure. At times, I took my son through all of ths with me. I am having a hard time forgiving myself for that. I gave my son an over abundance of love and guidance. But, there were aspects of our environment that I let in, trying to be loving and forgiving, that hurt him. This presence is helping me let go of that and move on.

I can almost see what he looks like. But, what I see is when I get a thought that is filled with doubt, he steps forward and kind of pushes his chest out. This tells me that I am strong and can do it--to cut it out with the negative thinking. His very presence reminds me of how much I am acutally loved and supported. This type of thing is hard to put in a journal. Wait a minute, I just did.

Thanks!

[George]

Dear Lola,

Many years ago, when I was a small child, my mom used to say, "The Lord moves in mysterious ways."

I could believe it. If the radio news broadcaster announced that some small child was missing in the Netherlands, all us kids used to look at mom. If she smilled, the child would be found. If tears ran down her cheeks, the child would be lost, likely drowned in a canal or a ditch. My mom was psychic, and had some unusual abilities, as if she was in touch with the whole world.

I'm just a channeler of messages, hardly a guru. I make no such claim, even resent the term. My Celestial Friends are the Gurus. So my short answer is 'I don't know.' However, I do know that too many expect too much, grow tired too soon, and give up.

Some don't ask for help from Michael, some have no clear intent other than to cast their eyes on a Midwayer. Some are battling with the emotional debris of the past. It takes meditation time.

In December of 1987 I was mugged and badly hurt. It took me until the mid 1990's to reconnect with my Friends -- only with automatic writing -- and until 2001 to hear them again clearly.

We have instant coffee and instant cream, no instant Celestial. What we also don't have is a decent inheritance of Adam and Eve's blood. They could 'pick almost any Celestial out of fresh air.' We've gotta work for it, but it's worth it.

Hugs...
George.

[LolaandLight]

Yes George, I understand. I had to, and still do, have, a great deal of work to move towards accepting this is and does happen to me and it isn't me being a nut. I actually ignored it a great deal of the time because I thought it was a product of my imagination or that I was crazy. Ignoring it and it persisting anyway is what was troubling me. Listening to it brings me greater peace. The thing is, it is constant. I have just been turning my attention away from it.

We don't live in a society where the spiritual is accepted as part of our everyday life. It is seen as exceptional or a sign of insanity. If you ask me, the Natives of the US were far more advanced than our current society over here. Thank you, you may not be a guru, but you do have the ability to turn on a light.

[George]

Dear Lola,

If you ask me, the Natives of the US were far more advanced than our current society over here.

Ye-e-e-e-es ! ... The red race was most spiritual. Like a bunch of terrorists we killed most of them.

We should have made love, not war.

God bless....
George.

[DJKENZ]

We should have made love, not war.

God bless....
George.

Yes we should've, and then we would have had a new race...PINK!
hee hee hee!

[George]

Hmmmmmmmmm!

Possibly not. Back in Idaho I met some that had red and white "blood," but I was more pink than they were.

God bless........
George

[LolaandLight]

Funny George. I always wondered why folks of Europeon descent were called "white" instead of pink. When you throw African American into the mix, you get all kinds of interesting colors in the offspring.